Surviving Toxic Relationships

Toxic Relationships

Toxic relationships abound in a character disordered world. Because narcissism prevails in our culture, folks have a hard time forging sound character. Ultimately, many folks find themselves in nightmarish relationships. Problem is, it’s hard to know at the beginning how toxic a relationship might eventually become.

Sadly, troubled relationships have become the new norm. All too many marriages fall apart. And too many families dysfunction. When our core intimate relationships fail, our community relations naturally suffer. Clearly, toxic relationships lie at the root of many of our social problems.

Surviving and Moving On

Hundreds of folks have written or worked with me on overcoming their toxic relationship ordeals. Many times, their experience left them deeply wounded and damaged in spirit. Time alone couldn’t heal, either. It takes more than that. First, you have to overcome the “gaslighting” effect. That’s the feeling of craziness skilled manipulators know how to create in you. (Read more about this in In Sheep’s Clothing.) Then you have to resolve all the “cognitive dissonance.” That means resolving the confusion about what’s true and what isn’t true. Then you have to reclaim enough faith to move on with some confidence. I wrote How Did We End Up Here? to help folks do these very things.

Preventing Toxic Relationships

You have to master some important life lessons to become  person of integrity. I talk about these “10 Commandments of Character” in my book Character Disturbance. Learning these lessons is harder than ever these days. Still, forging decent character depends on embracing the principles they teach. That’s why I’ll be releasing a whole new book on the subject sometime early next year. I’ve delayed its release because I want the book to be just right. I consider it my most important work.

Relationships naturally grow in strength, depth, and wholesomeness in the absence of character disturbance. And when our most important relationships are solid, we can expect the makings of a healthy community. It all starts with character.

Character Matters

Character Matters will feature previously aired programs Christmas Eve and New Year’s Eve 2017.

 

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33 thoughts on “Surviving Toxic Relationships

  1. I need to go over this one again. Having just cut off a narcissistic parent, who uses money amongst other ways to manipulate, it’s also learning to live on and grieve for someone who is still alive.

    Part of it is just knowing that I can stand on my own two feet-and learning to believe it-because when it’s a parent saying this, even though I am an adult, it’s been from such an early age that you know, if it’s Mom she must be right (doesn’t help that she’s so invested in being right either).

    Letting go is the hardest part.

    1. JC

      You are not alone. Your lifes experience is the same as mine.
      For startes, Every second you are living independently from your family you are winning.
      Whether they are maglignant or vunurable, They HATE INDEPENDANCE IN OTHERS. This is why I think They are so controlling. Your independance is a nail through their dark soul. If someone is drowning, It does not give THEM THE RIGHT TO DROWN YOU AS WELL, This is not selfish IT IS WISDOM
      As martha stout says;

      “Living Well is the best revenge”

      Live well JC, You OWE IT TO YOUR SELF.

      If I can advise, I will as best I can

      Regards

      Joey

      1. Joey, JC

        You both have come a long way. Joey, you are right, living well is the best revenge. However, it is not always that easy. I have found I needed to change the internal, subconscious tapes responsible for limited healing and open a straightforward dialogue with my inner child. Once our inner child is nurtured, understood and accepted, true healing begins.

        I have found it is more important to know what I think, want and feel rather than factoring in the wants and needs of the unhealthy individuals that are or come into my life. Truly, healthy individuals will not interact in a way that causes us distress, cause us to doubt ourselves, define/label us or our realities. Rather healthy individuals will build us up and add a feeling of acceptance.

        JC, when we are healing and I believe being an empath we will always be perceptive and can easily be hurt. Knowing my personality, this is true. As we heal and have more confidence in ourselves, understand the internal conflicts and dialog s of our past we are able to let the CD small minded individuals slide off our backs along with severing the unhealthy CD individuals from our families of origin.

        In reality, we are all a little crazy in our own way, this is not a bad thing. We all have our insecurities, our wants and needs, those special quirks that define our essence. When one accepts us for whom we are, warts and all, we have found a true person. Others who judge, make fun of, put us down are CD and need to be avoided. When we can discern these individuals and not react we rise above and grow.

        JC, you are by no means “Crazy” in the sense these CD individuals are trying to catoragise and box you in with. You have been severely traumatized and it takes others who have been there to understand. I have dealt with CDN all my life and yes, I have battle scars. The important thing is we know the difference, we have risen above and beyond the shallow world of the CD and are blossoming into who we truly are and that is a beautiful thing.

        Its amazing how far we have all have come since we first started posting. Its a wonderful feeling to have all of you as supporters and in a sense an extended family who understand.

        JC, I am glad you are proactive in taking charge of your health issues. If I was younger I would go back to school and study the same things you are. Instead at this time I dabble in homeopathic and herbal remedies which I find has helped me considerably.

        I truly admire you adamant stance to disengage and sever the relationship with your mother, not an easy thing to do. I had to do the same thing and am glad I did. Let it go for now, the future is waiting for you and when you aspire to new heights and understanding your life and yourself will change considerably.

        Hugs to you Joey across the ocean and Hugs to you JC, I think in a bordering state. Be well all of you and God bless

      2. This is to Lucy, Euxodia as well as Joey,

        Survive two toxic parents as it turns out. This one blew me away though is not a shocker. My sister was adopted when she was 15, custody of her was returned to her birth mother. I had always been told it was MOSTLY my mother’s doing.

        When you work a program, truths will come to light and you then have to decide if you are strong enough to work with what you do have. And to survive it-all of it.

        One thing I was always proud of was his service in the military-and I am still planning to work for USAA. But when I learned from my sister (who has copies of correspondence), that not only did my father participate in the process, he used his rank to do it (he retired as a rank of Col/Gen in the Army, Air Force, etc). At that time, was close to that rank (An XO).

        Someone said it was good that I had one non abusive parent, this I think and Dr. Simon is free to speak to it-an example of either covert aggression or maybe relational.

        He had told me I was one of the best things to happen to (kids happen FOR you, IMO) him. In truth, not the case.

        He is.

        1. (Almost, lol) anyone can feel free to correct me if I am wrong.

          Seems to me the biggest difference between my mother and my father, is that my father at least, felt guilty for the way things went-both at the time, and have gone since. The solution?

          Throw money at it. To my credit, I have taken it-financially, I needed it.

          That, stops.

          1. Sorry I lose my train of thought easily-with the way the gaslighting works, the biggest blessing is with my GI winding up at Mayo. I saw one of their psychiatrists got a copy of a letter from him (on Mayo letterhead) giving me a clean bill of mental health (laminating a copy).

            Now, any time anyone wants to try and tell people I am crazy etc?

            I will have (kidding, maybe) a framed copy of it. OK, a laminated one. One advantage of living in Iowa.

            Right now, one of the risks I am going to be running is the obvious with my mother-I have spoken to it before, and won’t be doing it again-with my father, I don’t quite know if I should bother confronting the issue-what I need to do is see the correspondence my sister has, especially if I am going to be working in AZ at some point in the next few years.

            Anyone who’s been a victim of gaslighting would understand the importance of having a letter from a psychiatrist at Mayo. “Current treatment is most appropriate. As my sister says, “you are the author of your own destiny.”

            Truly, my father does the same thing-when I needed more than anything to see my primary care doc-and a ride there, it was “I am busy.” When I tried something else, and said (and lied through my teeth), I had an appointment with a psychiatry? It was “I will be there in two hours.” When he arrived, I told him, “The appointment was cancelled!” And I slammed my door in his face, and went into my room and smoked a bowl. The therapeutic effect was that he hates it for one, but it does help anxiety. Twofold-the GI stuff is helped too. But for that, at my age, I owe no one one darned thing.

            IN some ways, that he feels guilty-I don’t know if that is a good sign or not. If he does, then why did he not man up and um, do something?

            But just to ask opinions of the group-and to Dr. Simon, if possible-thoughts would be appreciated. How I came out even halfway normal is probably really due to being pawned off on family friends, counselors and doctors-social retards maybe (a lot of the time, not always), but most have good consciences, and are generally, good people. Thank God, right?

  2. Merry Christmas Dr. Simon and all readers and posters of this blog. Its a great place to learn the practical aspect of healing or dealing with CD’s from those who have experience and have acquired knowledge. Best wishes for the New Year, and may you continue to grow in confidence.

  3. The holidays. It’s difficult. I am still having trouble making sense of what happened. 40 years of marriage – and it wasn’t all bad – but it was all twisted lies. It was making me, our friends and my family seeing me as flawed and incapable. It was not horrible – not in the sense it was for a lot of you. My ex-husband was very covert – enough that even now I doubt sometimes what I experienced.
    The only way I can keep my sanity is to reverse the roles. I imagine me saying and doing the things he did and I can’t imagine it. I would feel so guilty and horrible but 40 years of that going on – including a hug from him – is very confusing. It’s cruel.
    I may never recover from the mind games. I may never be able to make sense of it. I have to except that. I have to stop the voice inside my head that tells me it was my fault. I have to realize that voice in my head is really not mine, but his.
    I have lost a lifetime of friends that seem to believe his version of what happened. I have lost a lot in trying to gain my freedom. I am happier now and I’m also sadder – I finally have a grip on reality, there’s no depression or anxiety but there’s a sadness that I don’t think will ever go away.
    I spent 40 years trying to win his approval and love – how do you stop doing that? It is a reality of gaining your freedom. Part of you is going to be left behind – there’s no way around that.

    1. Jean you have just identified blocks to your own healing hon. Look at what you wrote.

      “I may never recover from the mind games.
      I may never be able to make sense of it.
      I have to except that.
      I have to stop the voice inside my head that tells me it was my fault.
      I have to realize that voice in my head is really not mine, but his”.

      If you believe this with all your heart life will bring exactly that to you. We get what we order. Half the time we are totally unconscious of it. You have just identified some of your beliefs. We will only heal if we change our core often hidden beliefs we have about ourselves.

      Try this:

      “I WILL recover from the mind games”
      “I WILL be able to make sense of it”
      “I have come to except the worst, I will now accept myself for who I am”.
      ” The voice inside my head can be stopped when I practice mindfullness”
      “I have to realize that the voice in my head is my own EGO holding and keeping me in a disempowered state of victimhood”

      The opposite of victim is not survivor it is creator. If you continue to give your power over to the narc you are actually disempowering yourself. While we concentrate on what was done to us we are not concentrating on our own healing and working towards our own healing and self empowerment. This ultimately means we need to stop searching for self validation outside of us and be everything to us the narc was not.

      Nobody is responsible for the quality of our experiences except us. We have ultimate power in this respect. It’s just that when we are in a disempowered state we don’t allow it.

      Go beyond anything you could possibly imagine. Do not listen to the voice inside your head it is legion. They are just unhealed aspects of yourself the narc reflected back to you. Accept your relationship as a gift toward self empowerment and healing. It is an invitation to get to the real Jean, by removing those aspects of Jean that never belonged to you but were conditioned into you due to your life experiences.

      This happens to all of us. Life delivers to us what we ourselves create. Life is sacred and divine everything works in accordance with perfection in order to perfect us.

      If we take full responsibility for us and not what was done to us we can move beyond that. To do otherwise is allowing the narc to hold power of you.

      All the best with your healing Jean, you owe yourself a better life and only you are able to achieve the very best or worst for yourself.

      1. It is difficult for me. When I say I am still very confused, I mean I am very confused. I KNOW what was done to me and said to me was wrong, but I miss him. I spent over 4 decades loving, living and dealing with the roller coaster. I’m not sure if all of a sudden there is a shut off switch for your heart.
        I am in therapy and have been for years. I am no longer depressed like I was while living with him. That was severe depression. I know I am likely still depressed but it feels more like sadness.
        Since I was 18 he was my life. Now I’m 62. I know I am putting up roadblocks to my own healing but the confusion is a real issue and keeping the process difficult. The hurt is real.

        1. Jean,
          It is confusing because what this man has done deliberately is so against YOUR nature and heart. But it wasn’t/isn’t against his nature, because his character is disturbed, distorted, unclean, ugly, selfish . . . on and on. My husband did similar bad things to me as well, 30 years of marriage. I’ll be paying for it the rest of my life – he got half of my pension after spending the savings (except for what was in my name only). What yours did with the Social Security is downright evil. And Of course there were good times, I think some authentic good times in my marriage, as I’m sure were some in yours. And yes it is sad for so many reasons.
          I felt healing came easier once I just accepted the fact that I was used and abused, that he isn’t/wasn’t the man I desperately wanted him to be. I was useful to him.
          And yes, when I do see him a sadness overcomes me, anger as well, but sadness, that is, till he opens his ugly mouth and what comes out of it.
          There is methods to retraining the way you think. You have thoughts that keep appearing in your mind that need to be stopped, and hopefully your counselor is teaching you how to control the thoughts. The thoughts become habitual.
          I’ve read somewhere that are thoughts, thoughts of the past and future are akin to hallucinations, it’s like an awake dream we are having, our mind creating scenarios, talking, illusions, conversations, all in our head. Once you begin to think that when you project your thoughts into the future it’s akin to hallucination, your thinking kind of changes. I know this is hard to understand – not sure if I’m explaining it correctly.
          I’d recommend The Four Agreements Toltec Wisdom Collections by Don Miguel Ruiz, to give you a different perspective perhaps of what goes on in the inner workings of our thoughts. There is The Voice of Knowledge (A Practical Guide to Inner Peace), The Four Agreements (A Practical Guide to Personal Freedom, The Mastery of Love (A Practical Guide to the Art of Relationship). Actually, I need to re-read them all myself. It’s a nice collection.
          Jean, don’t give up. You’ll find that peace.

          1. Jean,

            I understand full well what you are going through and I know Lucy understands too. There is immense sadness and loss when one looses who they love most in life. Jean it is not easy as you know to let go, however, you respected yourself enough to know the relationship was unhealthy and lacked true love consisting of genuine, sincere bond between two people.

            I know it took immense strength and fortitude to sever the bond and experience your life falling apart. It is extremely painful…
            Jean, there is also a part of us that is so enmeshed with the other that it is difficult to separate and remove that part of them that remains. On your part you had a deep spiritual connection and loved him with all your heart. Letting go fully is a process. We all let go in and make peace in our own time and way.

            However, Jean, the process and resolve more quickly when we have an understanding person in our corner. Therapists are good but the process can go on for years. There are ways to overcome
            and come terms with ones loss sooner.

            Jean, the best way I can explain it for now in relation to your post, it is like a death of ones loved one. I hate to say it we loved someone that truly wasn’t there. We survived on crumbs and dreams. In order to heal we have to get a hold on truth and reality. I have attached a link to the stages one goes through when a loved one dies by: Kubler-Ross. I think you will identity with these stages. Many times one gets stuck in one of them or by passes a stage they must go through in order to heal.. I know, because I got stuck. Jean, please read the link and let me know what you think and we can go from there.

            Hugs Dear One

            http://www.uky.edu/~cperring/kr.htm

          2. Jean,

            Lucy shared some excellent experiences with you and gave you some important resources to read which will help you. Joey, has also shared his experiences and how he has risen above and is making a happy and fulfilled life for himself after severing his relationship with his CD mother.

            If I may add another book that may be of some help.
            The Language of Letting Go by Melody Beattie

            Life can get better, it will take time and as you can see, everyone wants to help.

        2. Jean,

          Many 60 year old plus people are genuinely healing using a completely new method. Check it out – if it resonates for you give it a burl, if it doesn’t leave it but at least check it out.

          It cuts to the chase of our core wounds that allowed the narc into our life in the first place and kept us addicted to them.

          It’s worked for me and thousands of others I see marvelous turn arounds every day. Just watch some Melanie Tonie Evans UTubes. I’ve been doing it for 3 months and I am nowhere near the dark place I was before.

          You have nothing to lose except your pain.

          Cheers

          Eudoxia

    2. Jean

      there’s no depression or anxiety but there’s a sadness.

      I have been through this myself, I understand. I think you may be suffering from depression. I have been there, believe me I HAVE BEEN THERE.

      You need councilling. You need to see someone who is medically trained.
      I have been there, IT DOES HELP, BOY DOES IT HELP. I attempted sucide and was agoraphobic. The sadness is what depression is. That deep sadness, that you feel, is what is holding you back.

      Be happy

      1. Joey you have just described CPTSD – post abuse.

        Councillng by whom Joey? Unless it’s with someone who can hear you.

        To allow another to have power over you is not being your own self generated source of self worth or value – that’s powerlessness.

        The sadness is our own authentic self grieving for itself because it’s been abandoned by our false self. That’s my experience and estimation of it.

        If I blamed anyone for anything, including bad psychologists who couldn’t hear me but was dictating to me what would make me feel better?? huh come again…………..

        I would be making them more powerful than me and handing away the reins of my life in that respect. Fcuk that – No Way.

        I don’t do that – any more. It’s wise not to seek nurture from the betrayal source. The betrayal source in narc abuse is the abuser when we hand our power over to them.

        1. Eudoxia

          I believe Jean to lives the UK, Same as me. If I am wrong then OK. Seeking advise is not wrong, we need in times of trouble someone to explain thing that we do not see ourselves and a trained councillor is the best way. I am sorry you had a bad experience.

          1. Joey,

            I didn’t say you were wrong and I am not sure of what bad experience you are speaking about? We’ve all had bad experiences with narcs. However, many psychologists et all don’t have a clue about narc abuse unless they’ve been on the receiving end of it and my friend who is one will be the first person to admit that. She, however, was married to a narc and knows how it rolls.

            If a person goes to any health care practitioner who is unaware of symptoms of narc abuse and are not able to fully understand the true nature of the problem they can cause more harm than good.

            There are many life coaches out there now who are running solid programs for not only recovery after narc abuse but how to thrive after narc abuse. In order to fully heal ourselves we need to heal all of our core wounds, narc inflicted or not.

            Life coaches are not there to tell you what’s wrong and give you pills to relieve your sadness. They are there to tell you everything that is right with you and how to reach your authentic being and bring yourself into a fully confident, happy, centered and self empowered state and stay there.

            They teach you how to provide yourself with your own self validation and stop seeking it from external sources and that is a number one priority particularly if we do not want to attract anymore narcs into our own lives.

    3. Jean,

      I am so glad you posted, I have wondering how you were. I know the last time we heard from you you were having a rough go of it. I am glad you have you pet and hope he/she fills some void for you.

      I do understand were you are at. It is difficult to wrap ones head around, it is also more difficult to heal when one is alone and lacks support. It can take a lot of time and it depends how well you can disconnect, make peace and let go. Sometimes we may never quite understand or wrap our heads around what happened. The important thing is to take care of ourselves and heal.

      It is even more difficult to understand when we as a person would never do or think how the CD does, it is precisely how they can pull the wool over our eyes for so long.

      I personally think you can recover, it will be in your own time and way of understanding. I would also encourage you to keep posting as you will not be alone then and will have support from individuals who know you.

      I think you have two individuals in your head, both his and your own voice. You need to decide who owns the space in your head and stop believing the lies. We tend to beat ourselves up as we have no control over the CD.

      Jean, I don’t think you really ever had any friends to speak of if this is how you were treated by them in the end. It is normal to mourn the loss of what could had, should had, might have been. Many times we never get over the loss but in order to go on, we must accept and store away that memory. It is like mourning a death of a person we love/loved. For many it all doesn’t stop just because we got a divorce.

      I am concerned as you say your not depressed, what you have expressed sure sounds like depression to me. There is nothing wrong with being depressed, it matters though that you overcome the depression. I would look to taking some supplements you can get in the store such as Sam-e. I can give you names of others that are natural and can help.

      Also, this is very difficult at our age to start over. There are lots of things you can do to make your life more joyful and tolerable, otherwise, we just stagnate and this will be glory in the eyes of the CD.

      Jean there is a whole world out there, waiting for you. This is a moment in time you can rise above and make these the best years of your life. Who knows who may enter your life, it depends on if you can go forward or stay put. Dear one, at our age we don’t have time to sit on our derriere and feel sad even though I do at times too. Jean there are good guys out there, I know there are, it takes time and effort. Please don’t give up on yourself.

      Jean, please keep posting, we all are family of a sort, we know you, so its not like you are a stranger here. Know you are always welcome and I encourage you to participate and spill your guts here. Also, you impress me as one who rarely gets angry, I many times we need to get this anger out and this is a good place to be.

      Jean, Eudox gave you good advice on many things, you may not be ready for this yet, it can happen and its all up to you if and when. Take your time, but don’t wait to long, we are all here and want to help you through this. You see, sharing yours struggles make us all strong.

      Be well Jean and remember this is just another day, the hoopla will be over shortly and a new year starts. This coming year can be the start of a whole new you and a whole new world opening up for you. Don’t let it pass you by by staying stuck in the past. As always, I am here for you and so is everyone else.

      Be well and God bless

      1. BTOV- – I agree that the 5 stages of dying can apply. I do feel like I died but I also have the opportunity to arise from the ashes.
        Some days I rejoice. Some days are very hard. Christmas was hard. But yesterday I caught myself actually dancing while I was cleaning to music (haha – one of the benefits of living alone).
        I have The Language of Letting Go – a great book. I think I’ll pull it back out.
        I don’t post often but I read everything on this site – almost daily.
        I sent my ex a Merry Christmas email. It was one sentence – free of anger and pain. although I have dozens of unsent emails blasting him and asking him how he could treat me so meanly – I chose to send good wishes. I probably shouldn’t have sent him anything, but it’s what I wanted to do and actually made me feel more at peace.
        I am so very ready for 2018.
        Much love to all of you!

        1. Jean,
          If you were dancing you most certainly felt joy. So you’ve got it in you. It’s all that stinkin thinkin that gets in the way of joy.
          I’m still trying to quit thinking about what was, keep catching myself. It’s habitual.
          If you felt more at peace then you did the right thing. You can’t argue with that.
          I’d love to talk with you personally via phone or email. We’ve got a lot in common and it can be comforting and helpful to speak with another personally and touch base, on good or bad days. You can do this by requesting it through Dr. Simon. The same with BOVT. I’ve seen her reach out numerous times.
          For 2018, let’s all heal, resolve what’s happened and forge forward! The past stinks!

          1. Jean,
            I would encourage you to contact Lucy via Dr. Simon which is the proper protocol. Lucy is a great person and supportive too, she is very well versed in the CDN. If you have followed Linda’s story from the beginning when she first posted you will be impressed by all the tragedies and obstacles she has endured and overcome. Truly, a remarkable woman who has risen up against against all odds. Another remarkable person is Joey, a heartbreaking story and look where he is today.

            Jean, you have some great people in your corner. Truly, you will benefit from contacting Lucy. It is the first step to taking back yourself and opening up to a new relationship. You see you do have a caring friend. Lucy worried about you for a long time when we didn’t hear from you. Lucy is a loving and caring person who has a big heart and loves deeply.

            Jean, yes, the music, play happy music, dance and be merry. I forget at times and when I play the music it helps me to feel better.
            Keep doing this and reconnect to the part of you who has been locked away for a long time.

            Jean, I think you are a quite, reserved person and keep a lot inside. It’s can be a scary, awkward step to reach out to another. However, once done the relief sets in especially when you realize what you have gained from taking that first step. Lucy has reached out to you, she is offering to share her knowledge, her experiences and her gifts to help you on your journey. Truly, Lucy is a wonderful friend to have.

            You know Jean, I had commented in the past, we have had so many wonderful people, wouldn’t be awesome to all be in a gated community like the Golden Girls. Yes the Golden Guy’s would be the added touch. (Smile)

            Jean, stop being so quite over there, you bring a lot to this community, support group and family. I look forward to hearing more from you, it is healing to let it go and reach out.

            Hugs and many blessings to you in this coming New Year!

    4. Write down the ways that you have been manipulated and mistreated. Every time you start to wonder if it was your fault, re-read the list.

  4. Relationships naturally grow in strength, depth, and wholesomeness in the absence of character disturbance. And when our most important relationships are solid, we can expect the makings of a healthy community. It all starts with character.

    Spot on.

    I wish you a very merry Christmas Dr Simon and all the contributors to this blog. It has been an amazing year. I have no doubt we are all in a much better place than this time last year. I know I am. It has been an amazing journey.

    BTOV, LisaO, Lucy, Joey, AndyD, JC, Sydney and kat – Merry Christmas to you all :-

    Much Love & Gratitude

    Eudoxia

  5. To All

    Carl Jung

    And intergrated person does not feel ashamed of guilt or anexiety and fear also our own dark side. It is not something to be condemned and walled over but as something to be recognised as contributive to ones greatness and to ones positive aspects, in the same way that MANURE IS CONTRIBUTIVE TO THE PERFUME OF THE ROSE.

    Regards

    Joey

    Be Happy

    1. Joey,

      We all have a dark side and it is reflected back to us via the narc. Our Shadow is the walls we’ve built around our precious hearts to protect us from harm.

      When we are adults this no longer applies – we need to break down and dissolve them in order for us to not only love ourselves but be able to give love to and receive love to others.

      Bright blessing Joey

      Much Love
      Eudox

  6. Reading Jeans words reflected how I felt for a long time. CD behavior is confusing and hard to understand, but I finally came to the conclusion, it doesn’t have to make sense to me – it just is their dynamic and whoever believes them is just another person they have conned. They take pride in that, what does that tell you about them. Staying away from the CD is all one can do in regards to dealing with them. I wish you all the best Jean, you can go in a life affirming and positive direction now, away from the CD.

  7. Kat

    CD behavior is confusing and hard to understand

    That is why we spend so many waisted years, in their company.
    It is when you see the malevolence, in them that things start to change. You, and me and all of us here WOKE up to that.

    Kat and to All.

    Have a good And Happy CD FREE 2018

    My new year’s resolution is to be more optimistic by keeping my cup half-full with either rum, vodka, or whiskey.( JOKING)

    Have a Happy new year

    Joey

  8. Here are a few gaslighting techniques my evil older sister used to play on me, each lasted about 3 years:
    1. If I ever said something, she winged palms in front of her nose and made other body behaviors that would signal that my moth stinks;
    2. If I ever said something, she asked several times like “What?” and “Ah?” as I was not able to pronounce words clearly, and I had to repeat myself several times , no matter how much I tried.
    3. If I ever said something, she blamed me being like a immature 5-year-old-child in order to enforce me to question my ability to think like an adult.
    The pattern lasted as long I said her that no one else outside says/does these things to me.

    1. M
      sorry you have/had to endure such an ugly person. You said “used to . .” I hope you’ve found ways to not have contact with her. Who needs that type of treatment? Nobody!

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